[纖動-生態作為動詞]展覽系列講座2~林志明教授X策展人楊衍畇 (全文版）“Fibering-Eco As A Verb”Exhibition Lecture Series 2 Lin Chi-Ming(President of AICA TAIWAN )xDr. Yunnia Yang(Curator)

[纖動-生態作為動詞]

展覽系列講座第二場

時間：2017年9月23日   

地點：臺藝大教研大樓國際會議廳

[纖動-生態作為動詞]展覽系列講座(二）(全文版）

林志明教授(聯合國教科文組織國際藝評人協會台灣分會理事長，

國立台北教育大學藝術與造形設計學系專任教授)X楊衍畇博士(策展人 )

林志明教授(聯合國教科文組織國際藝評人協會台灣分會理事長)

右為「纖動」策展人楊衍畇博士

林志明教授（以下簡稱林）:

「纖動」與生態議題有關，但並非只是推動生態運動，探討的範圍蠻深遠，包括根本概念與衍生出來的想像，展出作品媒材主要示錄像，還是有一些裝置性的作品，要請策展人介紹策劃出發的概念與策展歷程，而展覽策劃出來也會有新的構想。Eco也有Echo回聲的隱義，事後在觀察展出作品間的關係，會有較為深刻的想法，開始有個出發點，展覽完成就像是大的裝置，不是像文字文本般閱讀，它是對我們感官有啟發性的。

楊衍畇博士（以下簡稱楊）：「纖動」展源起並非一個裝置展，它是為去年義大利阿索洛藝術影展邀請我做生態主題，因為當地生態相當特別，往返於台灣與義大利如此美景地方，自身感官狀態遭到衝擊，搭機十多個小時又回到台灣，原本面對平靜山居歲月的感受，突然要面對城市喧囂的反差，因此有許多想法。看到許多生態主題影展都是跟環境、環保議題有關的紀錄片，對一般觀眾習於敘事性或紀錄片式主題，但在那次策展經驗中，就選取許多以當代藝術手法如行為藝術，在影像上帶有宏觀的生態概念如文化生態。我將生態主題分為四大類：生態創意、生態啓示錄、生態鏈、生態神話，當時共有23部作品，在義大利影展放映時是一種流動狀態，像是看電影看紀錄片，大家對於生態的瞭解會因為導演如何詮釋就以他的觀點來看，但是到了展場當中，因為裝置與空間、時間非常有關係，它帶給你整體感官的衝擊，比僅是在影展片段式、一次式的影像放映會讓觀者思考更多，在那樣的環節當中觀者開始遊走每件作品，每件作品之間就有對應關係，為何A作要與B作擺置在一起就產生新的意涵。有章博物館是兩層樓的空間設計，必須顧及到觀眾在遊走時他們想法的可能性，會有新的想法出現，譬如有兩件裝置在這影展是沒有的，另外為俄國AES+F「顛倒世界」特別設計空間。我的策展意念靈感來自德勒玆「每一根纖維都是宇宙的纖維」，許多跟生態有關的議題透過社運，或是宣導短片已經看的過多，或是在媒體上很關鍵的議題如全球暖化，或是災難，已經發生在我們周遭，可是我們天天看到，已經被這些媒體的影像痲痹了，我們又如何活化我們的感知，這是我「纖動」的意念。德勒玆所談的纖維概念是相當跨領域的，是可以從人類、動物的流變，環境的關連性去思考，就如我們看到許多來自遠端的影像，透過光纖傳到我們的視網膜纖維，傳導到我們的腦神經，在宇宙萬物中，關聯性很大的是人類所攝取的資源，這些飲食也是纖維，所穿戴的衣服也是纖維，與我們生活息息相關，這些感知是可以串連的，只要我們發揮想像力與反思力。有趣的是在佈展時，像黃贊倫的[大衛-練習者]所在空間小，樓層低矮，藝術家將浪板屋切割符合成那樣空間設計，反而更加突顯他所生存的環境更加侷促狹隘，原本要投影在內，也沒有足夠空間投影，所以安裝監視器在外面，這更符合相互對話與觀照的環節，像一個loop可進可出。

林：分類特別提到義大利阿索洛藝術影展，很多影展都會有生態相關的影片，尤其是紀錄片，或是有生態災難喚起大家生態意識，或是特定議題的推動，如環境污染或是瀕臨滅絕的動物，或是垃圾回收的問題，物質再利用的問題，大部份都是很特定的議題。而現在當前展覽切分成四個子題區塊，其中影片數量各自不同，像是生態創意與生態神話作品較少，可否介紹生態創意的內涵，共有兩件，其中有趣作品是崔廣宇「城市按摩」。

楊：這兩件作品都有思考到我們的生態已經遭到破壞，生為人類的本能就是生存本能，我們如何改善既有環境，崔廣宇以往會以自己身體去探究環境之間與身為城市一份子的關聯性，像他之前有社會生態系列。身為台北新臺北人會接觸到的烏賊公車，他所作的裝置是可吸附在公車上面，就會幫這些公車改善，但實際上這些泡泡的形成是由它的廢氣，美麗的泡泡緣起是廢氣，對很多表象的東西都看似受吸引，但都沒想到背後其實是髒的，它的成形是付出代價的。

林：蠻有趣的，這不一定是在做生態學，很多作品可以放在這個脈絡或另外一個脈絡中，從形式角度放在機械動力中，或是藝術家在城市中的介入，放在生態學角度就會想這是否是生態學，因為一般公車廢氣要減少污染應該是排放內容的部份著手，可是現在處理的是動力，如熱能或風能，實際上我不認為他的泡泡能過濾那些廢棄物，泡泡沾到身上反而更嚴重，但它是一種回收概念，也有很多的嘲諷性。作品像是呈現生態學要如何做，卻反而是一種感性的推動，有種荒謬感讓人去思考這動作意義到底是什麼，進而想到泡泡是否美麗有趣，甚至想到童年，如果思考整個作品形成機制的背後卻有不同事物，若請環保人士來看，可能會去反對這作品。

楊：公車司機沒趕崔廣宇是以為他是稽查人員，藝術家看到一個問題，不一定能解決，他就將此問題放大思考，這就像是創意上的鍊金術士，讓我們在重新思考要用何種方式解決，用較有創意方式解決生態環境的問題。

林：「二手風」很特別，有點科幻小說味道，想像中經過浩劫過後的場景，假設人類發生核戰，物質匱乏，一片荒地，請談談這件作品。

楊：這件作品背景設定在末日後人類存活的世界中，世界已毀僅剩破銅爛鐵，已無原有大自然可以去享受，主角去尋找廢金屬製造出廢鐵花朵與花園，隨著鏡頭推移，他會有過去的想像，很多作品在時間軸中有所謂過去現在未來，現在可視為當下，過去是曾經的美好，或是與家人的記憶，當下他所面對的是廢墟，未來其實更加不堪，時間軸一直會在某些作品中出現。

林：我個人感覺是有點荒謬，浩劫後要維生就不易，如電影看到的情境，已經是荒蕪大地，要尋找生存資源，或是石油能源，而作者竟是做出一個沒有功用的花園，只是為了美感欣賞，也是蠻荒謬的。

楊：生態創意的主題是想要拉到當今現狀，其實有二手物資或資源回收，甚至為現在的困境找方法，如大家會到二手市場找衣服，或是有些市場經營此類交易，創作者利用這些二手物件再創造。

林：接下來談談生態啓示錄的概念，對這名字有點意見，啓示錄就不會是生態的，所以是生態上的破滅，但這分項影片也不完全是如此，多是在談科技的進步，到某種程度後物種人類跟環境產生的關係有很大的跳躍性變動。另外，「顛倒世界」的俄羅斯藝術團體AES+F在國際上相當有名，台灣也曾邀請過，影像有强烈的視覺震撼，內容則相當爭議性。

楊：這分類命名與影像特質是疏離我們，人與獸的結合，或是後人類，甚至有隱喻去轉化而成，看似像聖經啓示錄的末世預言，這預言是否會到來就看人類如何挽救。AES+F團體名稱以藝術家四人的姓為名，2007 年開始應威尼斯雙年展之邀，這是他們最近的新作品，2015 年的「顛倒世界」，可見很多道理都顛倒了，例如學生可以打老師，豬可以殺人，有很多奇怪的畫面是警察與小偷同睡在一張床上等等，這世界的倫理關係被瓦解，事實上它正是反應我們的現狀。

林：視覺上很像歐洲的寓言畫，像波希的畫，及宗教時代的繪畫感。

楊：很多影像是看似大場面，其實在構圖上常應用到藝術上的圖像學，但人物不會超過五、六人，拍完之後就會進入到電腦裏數位化。

林：平常有不同版本，現在是單頻錄像，也可有三個、七個畫面包圍展場，視覺感非常强，盡量使用慢動作。

楊：這些會飛行奇怪的動物就是Chimera，神話中令人有奇怪想像的神獸，所以牠也刺激他們，實際上是充滿了這樣的影響力，特別隱喻我們的視覺文化帶給我們這些奇怪的想像。

AES+F在音樂上的選擇偏好的是古典音樂，會不自覺非常熟悉，會順著音樂覺得畫面之間，全然沈浸其中。有觀眾質疑此般全部沈浸狀態是否會影響我們的反思力，可是這並不盡然，因為許多畫面是很荒謬詭異的。

林：動作夠慢也是有幫助的，在慢速中思考，節奏非常快則無法思考。

楊：AES+F有討論到當代藝術的一種美感似乎在表現醜，AES+F反過來表現當代藝術表現美的話也能突顯美中有醜的美學概念，許多視覺文化所帶來的美好的意象，如廣告或是宣傳給我們一種衝擊，底下卻有許多不美好的。這些意象的源起是來自16 世紀所流行的版畫，可以看到顛倒的意象，但另一個緣起就是中世紀的嘉年華，會在舞會交換面具，即有身分的交換。

林：Carnival在俄羅斯文藝評論家Bakhtin是重要書寫意象，衍畇去俄國留學期間是否觀察？

楊：俄國是有些特定的節慶，從冬天轉變到春天會有很盛大的慶祝活動，飲食象徵太陽意象的薄餅，民俗藝人與熊跳舞，這些主題在芭蕾舞作如尼金斯基的'Petrushka'也有反映到。

林：嘉年華的意象是古老的，是前現代所留下來的儀式，在歐洲還是有強烈的傳統。

楊：啓示錄系列中，Arcadia也值得談論，我們的生存問題是因為我們不斷地進步驅使讓科技改變人類文明，即所謂進化，進化真的對人類是好的嗎？或是當初原始純真的部份是比較適合人類，然而我們再也回不去了。Arcadia隱喻我們所追尋的桃花源是原始或原住人類的惡夢。

林：這裡開始有另一向度，對於我們來說是進步，對他人來說卻是災難。

楊：這影片用特殊手法，如超現實，或在身體表現上是一種日本舞踏的美學。影片開始出現YOU字眼，像是普桑Arcadia那幅作品，他們想要尋找心目中的桃花源，卻看到一尊墓塚，就永遠找不到象徵永生的世外桃源，此片亦有此指涉。

林：生態學在後來演變到生態政治學，生態相互連結的概念去改變政治，會造成思想上的革命，歐洲有很強大的綠黨，台灣也有綠黨但在政治上影響並不强，我們還未到那個時代。

楊：台灣在1995年就有一部以科幻題材為主的題格動畫「後人類」，這已距今22年，石昌杰當時觀察到人工智慧與後人類跡象，發展到現在像是預言式的見解。這些後人類學習人類文明的模式，如何思考與行為，最後受到人類思維影響發動核戰，也將會自食惡果。

林：今天看這影片會覺得畫質不太好，以電影影片去拍攝，今天很少人會以逐格動畫拍攝，不是用繪製或是用數位做出，這是石昌杰蠻街持的部份。下一個是我們比較談論的生態學問題-生態鏈，生態學的根本概念是許多事物的相互連結，因為有政治學意涵，這種相互連結會改變我們的高低層級既有觀念，是有其意識型態上的衝擊，跟政治意涵上的衝擊，生態鏈的部份好像跟一般生態鏈概念不同。

楊：這生態鏈的意念是從'Eco'字源而來的，原字有House或家的意念，家並非是純粹人類住在家中有所庇護的概念，而是從微觀到宏觀，從自身包括人類的身體可視為一個家，還有平常的家，以及整個環境也是一個家，整個宇宙所生存的空間，所以概念很廣，人類有過多的慾望，這個慾望不斷發展之下，反而會去危害這個家，對外物像時尚的需求，就會造成第三

世界為時尚賣命的人遭致不幸，如「為時尚捨命」。

林：「為時尚捨命」如早年~拍攝「城市交響曲」透過機械動力產生某種芭蕾舞蹈的感受。

楊：本片在前段以音樂影像傳達詩意的形式美感帶出後段工人悲歌命運，影像是真實事件，2013年孟加拉發生工廠倒塌，這工廠是為加拿大,美國品牌生產低廉價格的成衣，但工廠安全不是很好，他們拒絕賠償與改善，因此造成第三世界年輕女子生命白白犧牲，大家開始時尚背後的問題。

林：之前有個運動發起拒買過於便宜的衣服，因為很容易就將它丟棄，時尚快速轉換就造成快速的浪費。我們應該要抵制這樣的快速時尚產業，會讓人們產生快速消費的心理，這背後還有一整個工業商業體系，跨國企業剝削的問題蠻嚴重。剛才提到生態政治面，在「纖動」展當中就慢慢浮現了。

楊：這些文明的問題都可能發生在每個人身上，也發生在我的身上，刺激我必須要用策展方式去回應我們都是文明的受害者。

林：有部影片“Solostalgia”，翻譯為「鄉痛」，這特殊名字有何意涵？

楊：這名字是源自澳洲人類學家對於我們現在全球處於一種氣候變遷，甚至看到一些國家的內戰紛爭，我們人類也不斷遷徙，以及我們對於家的概念與感受，因為處於動盪不安的狀態，我們的身體雖然在自己的家鄉，卻會遙想我們理想的家，這不只是思鄉病(nostalgia)，是一種身體的不安感與不確定性所致，可能也與孤寂有關，就會產生此般特別的身體感受。這種感受可能我們都有，我們身在台灣也會有。

林：關於生態神話，請策展人談談此類別的構想。

楊：對於我們周遭的環境有許多觀察是相當個人與內化的，看到一草一物會去欣賞珍惜，甚至看一些古老神話都是從環境去思考萬靈論的想法，它本身就存在於人類文明中，若以神話觀點觀察一些現象，會得到很多啓示，也包括藝術家在創作時跳脫了那些比較具象的描繪，讓我們思考關於生態議題更深層次。

林：這讓我想到李維史托(Levi Strauss)「神話的起源」，人類為何要有神話，過去偏向19世紀想法是以神話解釋過去的科學，如雷電現象則有雷神，李維史托的觀點是人如何從自然變成文明，從而脫離自然，像是一種補償，生態神話反映這個部份，請策展人介紹其中代表性作品。

楊：先談劉肇興的「未央」，拍攝上百個台北夜市影像從俯視觀點看到夜市人群竄動的畫面，後製組成大蟒蛇或神獸利維坦(Levitan)，他很擅於以數位科技將現象轉化成有強烈隱喻的意像。最後想談的是西班牙藝術家Albert Merino的作品「風暴意象」，這件作品討論的是一種文化生態，我們常以本位主義方式去認識其他文化，以至於不是很貼切地認識他們而產生刻板印象，包括西方在哥倫布發現新大陸時發生很多誤解，像阿玆提克,印加,秘魯文明要以西方希臘羅馬神話去對應他們的文明與神話，永遠找不到可以解釋與認識他們的觀點，所以會不斷產生誤解。我們對於他者應該放下原先的見地，他的手法相當超現實，這是他一貫的風格，這裡面也會讓我們想到波希畫作的相關意象。

林：我發現整個策展以人類為中心的思考，會談到種族、政治、資源利用的問題，可是一般來說生態學還有一個面向是可以讓我們脫離以人類為中心的思考。

楊：策展主題為「纖動-生態作為動詞」，即是要捨棄過去認為生態是一種社會運動或是宣導活動，而是從己身出發，人類應發揮同理心,想像力,反思力，去轉化我們所面臨的生態浩劫，這生態浩劫並非只是環境，而是較為廣泛的面向，很多災難透過影像都會覺得很遙遠，「生態作為動詞」的意念就是要人類行動，為人類世的生態浩劫挽救與負責。

[Fibering-Eco As A Verb]

Exhibition Lecture Series~2nd Session

Time：Septembr 23, 2017 

Venue：International Conference Hall, Taiwan National University of Arts

“Fibering-Eco As A Verb”Exhibition Lecture Series 2

Lin Chi-Ming(President of AICA TAIWAN，Professor of department of Art and Design, National Taipei University of Education )xDr. Yunnia Yang(Curator)

Professor Lin Chi-Ming（Lin）:The exhibition “Fibering-Eco As A Verb” is related to the ecological issue, but it is not only to advocate environmental activism. What it discusses about is quite deep, including the fundamental concepts and its derivative imaginations. The mediums of its exhibits are mainly video, and some installations. I'd like to ask the curator to talk about her curatorial concept and curation process. The term “Eco” has the hidden meaning of “Echo”. Later after we observe the relations between the exhibits, we'll find the deep thinking. When finishing the curation just like an enormous installation rather than reading literal texts , it can illuminate our perceptions.

Dr. Yunnia Yang（Yang）：The exhibition origin of “Fibering” is not a video installation exhibition. It was made for the 35^th Asolo Art Film Festival , which invited me to curate a video project on the ecological issue in 2016. The Asolano landscape is quite special for me. When I went back from Taiwan to such a beautiful and tranquil space in Italy, my perceptions totally got shocked. After taking plane for 15-16 hours back to Taiwan, I suddenly have to confront the contrast between this tranquillity and our urban complexity. So many thoughts occur to me. I saw lots of green film festivals related to screening the documentaries on the environmental and ecological issues. In the curation for the Asolo Art Film Festival, I selected the videos based on the approach of contemporary art like performance art and on the macroscopically ecological viewpoint like cultural ecology. I divided the films into four categories: “Eco Creativity”, “Eco Apocalypse”, “Eco-Human Chain” and “Eco Mythology”. There were 23 films in total. In the Asolo film festival, the screening is a state of movement, just like watching a movie or documentary. The audience will receive the understanding about ecology because of the film director's interpretation. At Yo-Chang's “Fibering” exhibition space, the installations matter with time and space, which give you the whole sensational impacts. Comparing with the episodical screening in a film festival, the video installation exhibition allows audience to walk around the space to find the correlative relations among video works, and to ponder that Work A must be juxtaposed with Work B to create another new meaning. For Yo-Chang Art Museum's 2-floor design, I must care about the audience's spatial perceptions and possible interpretations. For example, two installations in Yo-Chang's version didn't be presented in the film festival and special spatial design is made for AES+F's “ Inverso Mundus”. My curatorial concept is inspired by Gilles Deleuze's “ Every fiber is a Universe fiber”. Many issues related to ecology are practiced mainly by social activism or short demo videos. Moreover, the crucial issues in mass media like global warming already happened around us. We watch them everyday,but get numbed by these overwhelming images. How we can restore our perceptions and sympathy? This is the core concept of “ Fibering- Eco As A Verb”. Deleuze's fiberal concept is very interdisciplinary, from the becoming of humankind and animals to environmental connections. We see many images transmitted from far distance through optical fiber to our retinal nerve fiber layer, then to our cranial nerve fiber layer. In Universe, what matters human existence is nutritive and protective source . These aliments are also fibers. What we wear is made of fibers. They are connected closely with our everyday life. These perceptions can be linked to each other only if we exert our imaginations and reflections.

Lin：About the categories at Asolo Art Film festival you mentioned, many film festivals have ecology-related films, especially documentaries , or films about environmental disaster awakening our ecological consciousness, or special issues for advocation like environmental pollution, endangered animals, or material reuse. The current exhibition has been divided into four sub-categories. Among them, the amount of videos is different. There are less works in “Eco Creativity” and “Eco Mythology”. Can Curator introduce the concept of “Eco Creativity”? One of two is Tsui Kuang-Yu's “ Beautiful Dirty Bubble -City Massage”.

Yang：In these two works, the artists think that our ecology has been damaged. As human beings, our instincts are the instincts of survival. How can we improve the current environment? Tsui used to explore the connections between our environment and each urban inhabitant with the intervention of his own body.In his social ecology series, gross polluters that the inhabitants from Taipei and New Taipei City know well are attached with Tsui's installation vehicle to improve air pollution. However, these beautiful bubbles are produced by their exhausts. In fact, the attractive appearance is concealed with the dirty truth. We must pay for this social problem. The bus drivers didn't drive Tsui away because they thought he might be an auditor. An artist finds out a problem that is not necessary to be solved out, then he enlarges this problem for thinking, just like an alchemist of creativity. It makes us to rethink about approaches to solve this problem, or to solve the ecological dilemma with more creative approaches.

Lin：His approach is quite interesting. He doesn't practice ecology necessarily. There are many works to be placed into this context or other context, into kinetics or artist's urban intervention from a formalist angle. From a ecological viewpoint, we'll think if this is an ecology for reducing exhausts from general buses, it should start to deal with the emitting contents. Now what Tsui deals with is a kinetic issue, like heat or wind. Actually, I don't think his bubbles can filter those exhausts . It will be more serious if the bubbles attach onto human body. He wants to show an idea of recyclery with a sense of sarcasm. He demonstrates how to do ecology with a romantic fantasy. The sense of absurdity makes us to think what this performance means in the end, then think if bubbles are really beautiful and interesting, or even think about our childhood. If thinking about the formal mechanism of this whole work, there are more different issues to be discussed about. If green activists watch this video, they might be against it. Besides, “ Second Wind” is very special, a bit sense of scientific fiction. Imagining the scenery after the Apocalypse, to suppose if humankind suffers from nuclear war and lack materials, a deserted land left. Please talk about this work.

Yang：“Second Wind” sets its background to the post-apocalyptic world, where there is only scrap metal left and no more the Nature we use to enjoy. The protagonist is searching for scrap metal to create scrap flowers and scrap garden. Following the camera, we'll see his imagination about the past. Lots of works have past, now, and future on the timeline. Now can be regarded as this moment, past was once beautiful, or the memory with family. When he faces to a ruin, future is actually more miserable for him. This timeline will appear in some video works.

Lin：Let's talk about the idea of “Eco Apocalypse” . I have some opinions about this title. Apocalypse can't be ecological ; ecology is annihilated, but the videos of this category are not totally shown in this way. Most of them are related to the progress of technology. After developing technology in certain level , relationship between humankind and environment had dramatic changes. In addition, “Inverso Mundus” is made by Russian art collective “AES+F” , which has highly international reputation and has been invited by a Taiwanese art institution. AES+F has strong visual impact and the contents of AES+F's videos are very controversial .

Yang：“Eco Apocalypse”'s imagery features are to alienate us, showing the combination of man and beast , or post human, even using the metaphors to transform them.It looks like the apocalyptic prophesy in the Book of Revelation.Whether this prophecy comes true or not, it depends on how human beings save themselves. The name “AES+F” is based on the surnames of four artists, who are invited by Venice Biennale since 2007. “Inverso Mundus” in 2015 is their latest artwork, in which we can see many facts are overthrown. For example, students can beat teachers, a pig can kill a man . There are absurd images, such as policemen and thieves sleep in the same bed. Ethnic relations are deconstructed in this world, and this actually reflects our current situations. Many images seems to be shot on a large scale, and used with iconography for composition. No more than 5-6 actors are shot at the same time. After shooting, the images will go into digitalization in the computer. In this video, one kind of creatures flying around is Chimera, a mythic beast bringing men strange fantasies so it also stimulates them. Full of such influences, it metaphorizes that our visual culture brings us these odd imaginations. In the selection of music, AES+F prefers classical music, which makes audience so familiar to indulge totally in the visual images . Some viewers doubt whether such indulgence influences our capabilities of self-reflection. It doesn't happen necessarily, because lots of images are absurd and uncanny. AES+F discusses that the aesthetics of contemporary art is seemingly to express ugliness, but the aesthetics of AES+F is to express beauty to highlight ugliness in beauty. Visual culture brings us beautiful images, such as advertisements or propagandas, which give us a kind of impact and beneath which there are many imperfections. The origins of these images are from the graphics popular in the 16^th century. We can see the images of an inverse world. One of the origins is the medieval carnival when exchanging masks each other in the masquerade. That is to say exchanging identities.

Lin: In “ Eco Apocalypse”, “Arcadia” starts to show another dimension. It might be a progress for us, but a disaster for others. Ecology evolves into ecological politics; that is to change politics by means of ecological interconnections to start thinking revolution. The European Green Party is strong, but the political influence of Green Party Taiwan isn't and we are still far from that.

Yang：In 1995, Taiwan had one stop-motion sci-fi animation called “ Post Human”. Since then it has been already 22 years old. Shih Chang-Jay observed artificial intelligence and post-human sign , developing till now just like a prophetic vision. These post-humans learn the model of human civilization, how to think and behave, and eventually get influenced by mankind to launch nuclear wars. These post-humans become the victims of their own evil deeds.

Lin：Watching this 35 mm film today, we might think its quality is not so good. Few filmmakers make stop-motion animations, hand-drawn or digital animations instead. This part is what Shih insists on. Next we are going to discuss about the “Eco-Human Chain”. The basic idea of ecology is that many things are interconnected. In the sense of politics, this interconnection will change our thinking about the hierarchy of ecology. It gives us ideological and political impacts. The videos from “Eco-Human Chain” are different from the general concept of ecological chain.

Yang：The notion of “Eco-Human Chain” originates from the root “Eco”, meaning “Home” or “House”. It doesn't only mean people live in a house to shelter themselves, but also means human body can be regarded as a home, a home psychologically and physically, and the Nature can be our house, even the whole Universe where we exist. This concept includes both microscopic and macroscopic viewpoints. Mankind has overwhelming desire. This desire continues to expand itself so seriously to damage this home. We pursue worldly possessions like fashion, which may cause the workers from the Third World the misery shown in the video of “Fashion to die for”. The video begins with poetic aesthetics of visual images corresponding to the incidental music to imply the tragic destiny of the labor. These visual images are based on the real disaster. In 2013 collapsed a factory building in Bangladesh. This factory produced low-cost garments for the worldly famous brands, but the safety of the factory wasn't qualified and they refused to compensate the victims and make improvements. This disaster caused the young women from the Third World the loss of their own lives in vain. It makes us to think about the problems behind glamorous fashion.

Lin：There was a campaign against the consumption of cheap clothes, because we throw them away so easily. Fast fashion makes fast consumption. We should protest against the fast fashion industry, which creates our complex of fast consumption. Behind this industry, there is a whole industrial and commercial system. The exploitation of multinational cooperations is terribly serious. The ecological politics we just mentioned shows up gradually in the exhibition “Fibering- Eco As A Verb”.

Yang：These problems of our civilization may happen to everyone and me, too. It stimulates me to respond to the reality that we all are the victims of civilization with the curatorial approach.

Lin：What does the video “Solastalgia” mean literally?

Yang：The title origins from the Australian philosopher Glenn Albrecht's concept . Our globe is under climate change and unstable national conflicts. For humankind is continuously in a nomadic state, it may change our concepts and perceptions about “Home”. Under such a turbulence, our body is at our homeland but we still long for our ideal home. It is not only a kind of nostalgia, but also uneasiness and uncertainty of our bodies. It may be related to loneliness, which gives us this special body perceptions. We all may experience it even if we live in Taiwan.

Lin：Let's talk about the notion of “Eco Mythology”

Yang：Many observations about our surroundings are very personal and internalized. We appreciate the Creatures in Nature as we see them. From ancient myths, we learn our ancestors develop Animism by observing the Nature. Animism exists in our civilization. We'll get more illuminations if observing some phenomena in the mythological viewpoint. It includes that artists get rid of those more figurative descriptions during their creations to make us to think about the ecological issues in a deeper level.

Lin：This reminds me of Lévi-Strauss's “Mythologiqus”, thinking why mankind has mythology. In the past, there was a 19^th-century trend to interpret the science with mythology, such as the phenomenon of thunder and lightning with Zeus. Lévi-Strauss thinks how human beings evolve from Nature into civilization, then get away from Nature. It is like a sort of compensation. “Eco Mythology” reflects this notion. The curator may introduce some representative works.

Yang：Spanish artist Albert Merino's “Imago Typhonis” shows us the concept about cultural ecology. We often get acquainted with other cultures egocentrically, so that we don't understand well their cultures and create some stereotypes, including terrible misunderstandings when Columbus discovered America. We will never understand the civilizations of Aztecs, Incas and Peruvians at all with the Greek-Roman mythology. We should put aside our prejudices. Merino's visual style is quite surreal, and the images may remind us of Hieronymus Bosch's paintings.

Lin：I found the whole curation is human-centered , related to the issues of ethnics, politics, resource usage, etc. However, ecology has one dimension to get away from the human-centered concept.

Yang：The curatorial title called “ Fibering- Eco As A Verb”; that is to say, to discard the idea that we thought ecology was a social action or campaign and to practice it by our own. As human beings, we should show our sympathy, imaginations and self-reflections to change the ecological disaster that we all confront. This disaster doesn't only refer to our environment, but also to all dimensions. It seems many miseries are so distant from us by visual transmission. The notion of “Fibering- Eco As A Verb” is that mankind must take action, responsible for the salvation of the Antropocenic impacts.